When Henrik questioned his role

[Angel S.]

I came across an old article & I was stunned, is this true??

http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/s2.cfm?id=146932002

"After 34 years in the role of a Danish Prince Philip, always a few steps behind his wife, Queen Margarethe, the prince has announced that he has had enough. In a fit of pique, the French-born former diplomat has abandoned the country in favour of his vineyards in France on the grounds that he is not appreciated enough. In the past he refused to open new buildings unless he was paid, a position that would have lost him his head in his native land. Now he wants to take precedence over his son and heir to the throne. Great offence was caused to his pride when he was not permitted to host a New Year’s Eve ball. Instead, protocol demanded his son, Prince Frederik, take on the task. "I have been satisfied with the role, but after so many years in Denmark, I don’t suddenly want to become number three and become some sort of wearisome attachment," Henrik said. In a demonstration of familial solidarity that might just shift his sulk, his wife and son rushed to his vineyard south-west of Paris to plead for his return. "

:unsure:

[Chickaree]

Hi Angle S.

I guess that the answer to your question is: Kind of!

Although "The Scotsman" is, I believe a generally respected news source, I think it has exaggerated, somewhat, the story in its article... For example I've never heard that Prince Henrik refused to open buildings unless paid... but as usual there's probably more to that story than is reported here....

Here are links to the BBC reports on this same episode...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/1801763.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/1815900.stm

Prince Henrik was asked recently about all this and essentially said, that life has moved on and he has put the issue behind him...

I think it is interesting to note how the family handled this... Instead of sitting in her palace in Copenhagen Queen Margrethe goes off to France to talk things over and resolve the problem

Hope this is helpful...

[Alisa]

I agree about the Scotsman's exagerration.

I think Queen Margrethe directly speaking about the problem was the best solution.

See:

Marriage tips from Queen Margrethe

[Angel S.]

Hi Angle S.

I guess that the answer to your question is: Kind of!

Although "The Scotsman" is, I believe a generally respected news source, I think it has exaggerated, somewhat, the story in its article... For example I've never heard that Prince Henrik refused to open buildings unless paid... but as usual there's probably more to that story than is reported here....

Here are links to the BBC reports on this same episode...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/1801763.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/1815900.stm

Prince Henrik was asked recently about all this and essentially said, that life has moved on and he has put the issue behind him...

I think it is interesting to note how the family handled this... Instead of sitting in her palace in Copenhagen Queen Margrethe goes off to France to talk things over and resolve the problem

Hope this is helpful...

Wow thank you, I had no idea this had gone on. It seems to me prince Henrik is a very proud man & perhaps tends to let things get to him. Maybe it's a male pride thing?? I don't think many women in his position would feel that way. I would happily step aside & watch my son take center stage, after all Fredrik is the future King & it's his job so it's only normal.

It seems Henrik has missed the point, it's important to see the difference between personal status in a family & the job you are there to do. I don't think my parents would be offended if I was to take center stage as head of the family in certain situations. In fact I have represented my father in some business dealings while he was content to step aside & let me do my job. I don't think he ever felt like he was being downgraded. It's all about perspective I guess & Prince Henrik seems very stubborn.

[Chickaree]

I agree about the Scotsman's exaggeration.

I think Queen Margrethe directly speaking about the problem was the best solution.

See:

Marriage tips from Queen Margrethe

Alisa,

Thanks for the link to this lovely interview with Queen Margrethe... I can certainly recommend it too!! I love the part about her cutting out bits from Sotheby's and Christie's catalogs and sticking them onto boxes!! ... What a "down to earth" real human being!!

Angel S,

Yes I do think you have "hit the nail on the head" ... this is a male thing... and probably goes back to the long history of male dominance in western society.... I do think that Prince Henrik has resolved the issue... For some important additional insight into this complex man be sure to read Henrik's book...."Destin Oblige

[jessiwessi]

Oh, well, this topic was actually really missing on this board, thanks for creating it, FrederikIX.

I am full of the deepest respect for the couple and the whole family how they figured this situation out, talked about the whole "crap" and found out how to get along well with each other again. I can imagin how hard this situation must have been, especially with the eyes of the public on you all the time...

[hotdog]

Poor Margrethe her stress levels must have been through the roof, first her husband's off having a mid-life crisis which she can't keep from the press just as the eldest son is trying to bring his very serious relationship round to meet Mum (and Fred wanted that kept from the press too).

Ninka  translated by Thor:

"The meeting took place while I was living in Paris, around April 2002."

Hotdog

[mayflower]

This is from BBC about Prince Henrik returned home.

Wednesday, 13 February, 2002, 07:49 GMT

Runaway prince returns home

Prince Henrik is said to be "no longer downcast"

The husband of the Danish queen is returning home on Tuesday, three weeks after quitting the country for his native France.

Prince Consort Henrik left Denmark claiming that his status in the royal family had been downgraded, and saying he wanted to "reflect" on life.

His departure sparked rumours of a possible royal marriage split, but Queen Margrethe went to visit him at his chateau at Caix in southern France, and the couple told journalists they were happy to be together.

"I can confirm that he will be flying back from France today," a palace official told BBC News Online on Tuesday.

The 67-year-old prince was reported to be "no longer downcast".

Reception row

He is expected to resume his role in public life.

The incident which sparked Prince Henrik's departure was a royal reception on New Year's Day, at which the couple's son, Crown Prince Frederik, was given higher status than he was.

The family will be reunited in Copenhagen

He told a Danish tabloid newspaper, BT, that royal staff had shunted him into "third place in the royal hierarchy" behind Crown Prince Frederik.

He had felt "pushed aside, degraded and humiliated", the newspaper reported, and his self-respect was being destroyed.

"For many years I have been Denmark's number two," he said. "I've been satisfied with that role, but I don't want to be relegated to number three after so many years."

Prince Henrik was born Count Henri de Laborde de Monpezat.

Good news

He changed his name to Henrik as a mark of respect for the Danes, but in his newspaper interview he said the Danish people had never accepted him despite 35 years of marriage.

Prince Frederik had told the Danish paper that his father was unwell, and needed to "remain calm".

The crisis-hit family have had one piece of good news. Prince Joachim and his wife, Princess Alexandra, announced last Friday that their second baby was due in August.

The couple already have two-year-old child, Nikolai.

[mayflower]

From Hello Magazine

First public appearance of Margrethe and Prince Henrik of Denmark after his "crisis"

FEBRUARY 2002

The reopening of the Danish cultural centre in Paris should have been a quiet affair. It has drawn attention, however, because it was the first official event presided over by Queen Margrethe and Prince Henrik of Denmark, since the prince’s astonishing statements at the weekend that he feels “relegated” and “useless”.

In a two-part interview given to the Danish newspaper BT, Prince Henrik expressed his dissatisfaction at what he sees as his being demoted to the number three position in the social functions of the royal household, behind his son Crown Prince Frederik. He told the publication, he was, “living the greatest crisis of my life”.

At the opening on Tuesday, however, he appeared to have regained his confidence and approached his official duties with zeal.

Margrethe and her husband seemed unaffected by the attention and appeared relaxed, smiling and in high spirits. Margrethe wore the same coat she premiered at the wedding of the Dutch Crown Prince Willem-Alexander to his Argentine sweetheart Maxima Zorreguieta in Amsterdam, this weekend.

As soon as the Dutch wedding celebrations came to a close and prior to the Paris visit, the monarch and her two sons rallied to the prince’s side at the family’s official residence in Caïx, south western France. The prince told the press yesterday that he and the Queen were, “very happy together”, quashing rumours of marital estrangement, and the family expressed its total support for the prince.

Henrik left the Danish capital last week after giving the interview to a national daily, saying he needed time “reflect on the future”. He has now made it known that he will spend a further week in Caïx, his hometown, supervising work on the family vineyard, before returning to Copenhagen.

Prince Henrik and Queen Margrethe have been married for 35 years. They met in London while the then Crown Princess was studying at the London School of Economics and the the prince was the third secretary at the French Embassy. The couple have two sons, Crown Prince Frederik, born in 1968 and, Prince Joachim, who was born the following year.

[emi]

Found this article on the net from a Danish university magazine. It gives some (IMHO) interesting opinions about Henrik's transition from French diplomat to Danish prince consort.

A Royal 'Crisis'

written and collected by Jessica Donnell

It all started somewhere between Christmas and New Year's. Queen Margrethe II had suffered some broken ribs and was not going to be able to carry out some of her usual functions over the New Year's holiday; although, she did manage to give her traditional New Year's address to the people of Denmark. So, it was Crown Prince Frederik who officiated in her stead at the annual New Year's state receptions, to which all of official Denmark and the diplomatic corps were invited.

The heir apparent, it is only natural that Prince Frederik, a grown man of 33, should fill in for his mother at state functions whenever she cannot be present herself. However, on this occasion, Prince Henrik, the Queen's husband and Crown Prince Frederik's father, felt himself humiliated and demoted to the rank of three in the royal hierarchy.

Consequently, Prince Henrik retreated to the royal couple's chateau Caix in Cahors, France, to take some time out to think things over. It was here that he gave the unprecedented interview, published February 3 in the daily tabloid B.T., in which he openly expressed his emotions and the frustration he has experienced, not only at the New Year's receptions, but throughout his long career as prince consort.

The interview sparked a variety of reactions from the media and the Danish public, drawing both sympathy and harsh criticism. So-called "experts" began to speculate about the future of the monarchy and the royal couple's marriage despite Prince Henrik's insistence that he does not blame his son or his wife.

At the heart of the matter, were two main issues: that of the royal hierarchy and whether the New Year's reception is an official state ceremony or a social event. According to Prince Henrik, the regent and his/her spouse are number one and number two in a monarchy. A crown prince is number three (Cath). He recognises that, "Number three [Crown Prince Frederik] is there in certain state connections to take number one's [Queen Margrethe's] place, because he is the crown prince, but only in those matters requiring the power of the Crown. He cannot take number two's [Prince Henrik's] place on social occasions" (Cath). Prince Henrik quite clearly considers the New Year's receptions as social rather than official.

Some of the harshest criticism came from Claus Ebbe Bjørn, a historian and lecturer at the University of Copenhagen and expert in the Danish monarchy. He is quoted by Kirsten Elley of Jyllands-Posten as saying, "The Prince [Henrik] has no state duties, and the New Year's reception has the mark of a state ceremony." According to him, Prince Henrik serves only to help perpetuate the royal family - nothing else.

Was there more to it?

Claus Bjørn believes that had the New Year's receptions been an isolated incident, it would have been dealt with internally, but the fact that Prince Henrik went public with it must be a sign that he has had a lot of pent-up frustration brooding for years - the receptions were just the last straw (Ritzau).

The Language Barrier

One reason for this could be because, as Kristian Lund of B.T. puts it, "Danes have never really been particularly kind to him. We've all had a laugh over his obvious difficulties with our language and his very French way of doing things." A frequently quoted statement from Billed Bladet, the self-proclaimed royal magazine of Denmark, pointed out that "What Prince Henrik could not manage to do in 35 years, Alexandra [wife of Prince Joachim, the younger of the royal couple's two sons] has managed in less than seven. She speaks Danish pretty much without an accent."

Actually, Prince Henrik does have some linguistic abilities. He has studied Chinese and Vietnamese at the National School of Oriental Languages in France, and he holds a master's degree in French literature and oriental languages. This might make it hard to understand why Danish has been difficult for him. However, Danish was not his second or even his third language; and, although Danish grammar is fairly simple, its pronunciation can be very difficult.

Lack of Recognition

Prince Henrik believes that he is liked by the Danish people, but he wonders about their impressions of him, when he is belittled and humiliated. After thirty years as prince consort, he still feels that he has not been accepted and that his work has gone unrecognised (Cath).

Unequal Treatment

One important issue that Prince Henrik does bring to light during the interview is the difference in the way female spouses of male monarchs are treated vs. male spouses of female monarchs.

He points out that no one has ever even thought that Sweden's Crown Princess Victoria should come before Queen Silvia, nor did anyone ever ask then Crown Princess Margrethe to take the place of her mother, Queen Ingrid (Cath). There is/was never any doubt regarding their position in the royal hierarchy.

By contrast, in England, it has always been the case that the one closest to the throne takes over when the Queen is indisposed, not Prince Philip (Elley). The same has been true in Holland, which also has a female monarch.

The difference between the sexes may have something to do with their respective titles. When a king gets married, his wife becomes queen. However, when a queen gets married, her husband cannot become king, because this title would imply that he ranks higher than she. Therefore, he becomes simply a prince.

A Clash of Cultures

Some "experts" have speculated that the reason behind Prince Henrik's outburst might have something to do with his French upbringing.

Though not commenting on the situation in the royal family, Harald Klitgaard, the French consul in Aalborg, stated that during his generation, it was the father who made the decisions in the family. The wife was to be silent, and the children were too (Wormslev). Young men were brought up to raise their families in the same way. He believes that this must have resulted in some clash of cultures when French men married Danish women who were accustomed to men and women having more equal roles in the home and in society.

Prince Henrik (68) belonged to this generation. In marrying Crown Princess Margrethe, he had to accept that he would always come after her. As the head of the home, however, he does not feel that he should have to come after his son.

Who is to blame?

During the interview, Prince Henrik seemed to lay the blame for his crisis on the media. He was probably referring to their response as soon as it was learned that Queen Margrethe had been injured. First, they called on Prince Frederik to help his mother, and then they praised him when he did, and talked about how Prince Henrik had been replaced as number two.

Foreign Minister Per Stig Møller seemed to share this sentiment. He said, "I can see that, according to the newspapers, there is a crisis; but now I'm going to be with the royal family this afternoon [for the reopening of the Danish House in Paris], and I take that to mean that there is not any serious crisis…" (Ullerup).

Crisis Resolved

Not long after the interview, Prince Henrik was joined in Cahors by the Queen and their two sons, who appeared to give him moral support and to help him through his crisis. Since the media do not seem to care about it any more, it would appear that all has been resolved and that everything is as it should be again, at least in the minds of those involved - members of the royal family.

The intent of this article, therefore, has not been to perpetuate or even revive the crisis, but rather to inform non-Danish speakers of what has been going on. That said, I will say no more on the matter.

Comments:

Jacques Hersh, Professor

Research Center on Development and International Relations

Institut for History, International and Social Studies

Aalborg University:

Identifying myself more as a Republican than as a Monarchist, I find the internal problems of the Royal House rather uninteresting. It didn't make the front pages in France as far as I know. The use made of this dispute by the Danish media on the other hand has been rather surprising. I think that the deplorable behavior of the prince has been made use of in order to ridicule a foreign aristocrat. But the media love to treat irrelevant events and give them an importance which they don't deserve. I think that in the present case, it is the media which should form the focus of attentionas triviality is generally given more prominence than substance. This in passing is a very serious problem for democracy.

In French society, as well as in other societies, gender roles were quite noticeable at the time of the youth of the prince. However, I don't think this is the most determining aspect behind Prince Henrik's behaviour. After all he was not born yesterday and has had a few decades to adapt to the change of wormen's positions and roles in society. Even male chauvinists have changed and I am not saying that gender role was part of the problem. The man has perhaps a temper which led him to wash dirty laundry in public. I don't think it is necessary to look for culturally or sociologically based explanations for what is essentially an individual personality problem. The prince's private sphere has been invaded through his own initiative.

Link to article from magazine by Aalborg University

[BrooklynGirl]

emi:

Thank you very much for providing this interesting article, giving all of us some further insights into the life of a royal male consort.

"BG"

[lotte]

Good find, emi.

I find Henrik quite an interesting figure.

His situation is not unlike Mary's is now (new language, new country but marriage based on love), except that her gender does change the experience F&M will have as a couple.

He has obviously had to subsume his own prowess in career and intellect beneath the task of being a consort.

The remarks in the article about his attachment to outmoded chauvinism re the roles of female monarch and consort seem to accord with some remarks Frederick has made about his strictness and approach to fathering with F&J as children and adolescents: perhaps playing the role of the classic French bourgeois father?

He fascinated me at the wedding. HE was the one who greeted Fred & Joachim in a fatherly and warm way at the alter, while Magrethe followed his example later (she had blown them kisses), while Henrik embraced and kissed his sons. THEN he fiddled and looked as if he wanted to be anywhere but in that church for most of the service!

Whenever I have seen him in photos since he seems to have the same air: he's doing it for his wife/for Denmark??? Who knows? I know there have been ructions caused by him in Denmark over the years, but he has been so much better than Philip in Britain for example, who will probably put his foot in it till the day he falls off the perch. But then, I would say too QMII is deserving of someone better than Philip! Over the years he has revealed himself (Philip that is) as racist and a bit of an insensitive clot who is not above ridiculing ordinary people. Henrik doesn't seem to have been as bad as this to me. Perhaps Henrik is somewhat elitist? But I would have thought all of the royal family is the same: that is the cloth they are cut from and their job and the job of the court is to make them appear at one and the same time 'special' and 'the same as us' to maintain the legitimacy of the RF in a constitutional monarchy.

Reducing his role to breeding (which is also being done to Mary), is unfair IMO when there is also a loving marriage and all the normal instincts to have children and construct a good family which goes along with being a rounded human being-- just like the rest of us!!

My penny's worth

lotte

[kobe]

I think that henrik got so frustrated to the point where he wanted to talk to the press. maybe he thought if he said something they would stop comparing him to to alexandra on the language skills. I find it interesting that he speaks asian languages, than again these languages are from countries where france colonized.

[EWS]

there are so many things about this.

i mean on another hand you have to look at the sexism of mary and alexandra, maxima, etc...its always commenting on their clothes and how they do their hair and they have to be fashion plates and clothes horses.

they are snapped up for all those women type magazines

henri - being male - they dont' care about his fashion or wanting him for any interviews really and they have emasculated him...but then whilst the emasculate him, they're ultra feminising the females who marry into royalty.

i'm probably not explaning myself but look at how many threads there are on mette-marit, mary, maxima, mathilde's clothes, shoes, hair, designers, what outfits they've worn a few times etc etc.

yet not much about other things. theyv'e all had to marry into this whole system and completely give up everything to be scrutinised for all of this stuff

[hotdog]

EWS

I think there is always a fear that a prince consort will actually end up with the power.

Both Prince Henrik and Prince Phillip have poor relations with the press.

I think it is easier for the press and public to accept a female entering the royal family especially if she is attractive and they can fill endless columns commenting on her clothes etc. It becomes harder when she wants to take on a "real role" then the discussion will begin on whether enough time is being spent on motherly/wife duties. Yes it's very sexist.

I guess the public and the press want the consort (male or famale) to stand well behind the heir in a supporting role only. The problem is keeping intellegant adults who have had professional jobs previously meaningfully occupied. Look at the Japanese situation.

Hotdog

[EWS]

EWS

I think there is always a fear that a prince consort will actually end up with the power.

Both Prince Henrik and Prince Phillip have poor relations with the press.

I think it is easier for the press and public to accept a female entering the royal family especially if she is attractive and they can fill endless columns commenting on her clothes etc. It becomes harder when she wants to take on a "real role" then the discussion will begin on whether enough time is being spent on motherly/wife duties. Yes it's very sexist.

I guess the public and the press want the consort (male or famale) to stand well behind the heir in a supporting role only. The problem is keeping intellegant adults who have had professional jobs previously meaningfully occupied. Look at the Japanese situation.

Hotdog

Oh absolutely I agree with you and i really think they need to look at the roles spouses play and allowing them to keep their day job or at leasty doing more than just cutting ribbons and holding posy of flowers and just sitting on boards.

i think princess alexandra is fantastic but i can't hlpe but think sometimes she is wasted considering how much talent she has from the business world. i know she sits on boards and is active in the UN but lets face it. thye're expecting her title and her face for the cause rather than much else. amd the pressure she had on her to produce an heir. i'm glad PA took her time and didn't get bossed around.

its totally sexist and to think that they will "take the power" is what probably causes the problems in the first place./

ui feel sorry for whomeever princess victoria marries because he's going to have to deal with similar shite.

having said that i think its hysterically funny that this grown man has a hissyfit and whines to the press and heads off to france. he probably has legit gripes and shit to deal with but it is also funny as hell. especially to think the queen and the princes had to probably run to france to coax him out of his hissyfit and soothe his ego. <:>

[SANDY]

The prince henrik crossed one moment of doubt and of depresses compared to its role.

It is more difficult to be the husband of a queen than the woman of a king. The women bring a key of glamour, of elegance in monarchy.

And then a man with always more evil to be the second behind his wife.

The Language Barrier

One reason for this could be because, as Kristian Lund of B.T. puts it, "Danes have never really been particularly kind to him. We've all had a laugh over his obvious difficulties with our language and his very French way of doing things." A frequently quoted statement from Billed Bladet, the self-proclaimed royal magazine of Denmark, pointed out that "What Prince Henrik could not manage to do in 35 years, Alexandra [wife of Prince Joachim, the younger of the royal couple's two sons] has managed in less than seven. She speaks Danish pretty much without an accent."

In a foreign language, hardest is the correct pronunciation of the words. For example When I intend to speak English or American in French, they have a terible accent even those which live in France since years;Prince Henrik comes from the South of France and people have pronounced an enough accent, that does not have to help it in the Danish training. Moreover Mary it even said that hardest was the good pronunciation of the words.

[kobe]

I have just read an article about how M talks of Henrik crisis. She said that she was in part to blame because she did not know how to help Henrik. She also said that she was fortunate to marry him when she was a princess because she believed that it was more daunting for a man to marry a queen. she also said that they have gotten over their crisis and they have a good marriage. I agree with M that is is more daunting to marry a queen rather than a princess.

[Greek Girl]

I too read the same article as kobe and found it very interesting.

It does give you some insight as how hard it must be to marry into Royalty, especially when the partner is from another country .

I liked the way the Queen was very honest about her thoughts.

She was also very complimentary to both her daughter - in- laws, which was also nice.

Cheers, Greek girl

[Guest ecinaj]

I fully agree that the pronunciation is the most difficult thing to conquer when learning another language. I have a Korea born Australian friend who came to Australia as an adult and reads and writes english perfectly, but when she speaks it I have to give her my full attention and listen carefully. However, other friends, who also migrated here as adults from different countries, only have slight accents but do not read or write the language. It must depend on the individual.

Anyway, QMII loves her husband and he loves her, so, that is good enough for me.

Cheers,

Ecinaj

[w_tanoto]

Lovely picture!!! I guess they love each other! He's right that he should take precedence over his son, but showing his emotion to the public just seems inappropriate

My personal opinion is that Frederik should take precedence over his father slowly. He will be king, and his father won't. So, I think P Henrik have to adapt to it. :unsure:

I guess he will fled denmark again after frederik become king, because he won't be number 2 as the number 2 will be "Queen Mary".

That's just my personal opinion

[mayflower]

I guess he will fled denmark again after frederik become king, because he won't be number 2 as the number 2 will be "Queen Mary".

Prince Henrik has deep interest in wine making and writing poems. If at all in future he fled from Denmark and seek refuge in Chateau de Cayx it will be purely to relax and pursue his interests in his winery and writing more books and not otherwise. He has been doing that quite often. Just my opinion.

[BrooklynGirl]

I guess he will fled denmark again after frederik become king, because he won't be number 2 as the number 2 will be "Queen Mary".

Prince Henrik has deep interest in wine making and writing poems. If at all in future he fled from Denmark and seek refuge in Chateau de Cayx it will be purely to relax and pursue his interests in his winery and writing more books and not otherwise. He has been doing that quite often. Just my opinion.

Yes, I too am glad that he has his favorite things to pursue and has interests.

that is health in a relationship.

"BG" ^heart^

[Guest ecinaj]

Prince Henrik may spend some time in France in the many, many years hence (and if QMII pre-deceases him) when Frederik is King, but I personally do not think that he will put too much distance between himself and his grandchildren whom he obviously adores. I also believe that his mid-life crisis was just a hiccup in their life and is now over.

Cheers

[gattica28]

You know...in this male dominated world...it must be difficult to be a Prince Consort...walking '2 steps' behind your wife from a protocol point of view. Its takes a special man to be able to cope with that role without his ego getting in the way. I wish the future Crown Princesses and future Queens all the luck in the world of finding special men who will become their Prince Consorts!